FLCC> tues ayes

[Bill Goffe]

Just my $.02 worth (have never done an FLCC Tuesday night ride), but maybe
practice neutralizing a corner or whatever as a group? In general, it
seems hard to do something as a group when the adrenaline is flowing and
the heart is pumping that you haven't done before or is out of character
with what you're doing at the time. Some may not like the analogy, but
there is a reason those in high-stress environments (military, police,
firefighters, take your pick) practice in low-stress and then high stress
environments. One often hears, "the training kicked in" when they're faced
with a tough situation.

     - Bill


Peter said:

> Ano, you're not crazy, and I'm glad you spoke up.
> 
> The talk is always neutralize, neutralize whenever there's an obstacle, 
> iffy corner, traffic, etc... But the walk... the walk just ain't there. 
> Every time we come to a corner it's the same story -- some one yells 
> "clear," which is good because we weren't going to stop any way If there 
> was a car coming? Well, pray for out soles, I guess. I don't think I've 
> ever seen a tnr neutralized.
> 
> I'm sure every one's seen the photo that has circulated recently of a 
> car plowing into a group of riders. That's a pretty sobering thought. I 
> think we should pretty much all be able to understand what even the most 
> experienced drivers reflexes will do when confronted with a head-on 
> collision.
> 
> I don't mean to criticize any one in particular. I think the issue is 
> clear: it's a group mentality. The first guy doesn't want to loose any 
> advantage so he rolls through as fast as possible with a quick check to 
> see if he's about to die (because by that time, what would you do?). The 
> next guy doesn't want to loose any ground, so he stays as close as 
> possible to the first guy... the third guy... the fourth guy... somebody 
> doesn't want to get dropped, somebody wants to use their cornering 
> skills... The whole group comes thundering through and nobody though, 
> oh, lets play chicken or Russian roulette. The story's the same whether 
> it's the corner of Coddington and White Church or the crest of a hill or 
> a dog. The fact is, in some ways it's pretty amazing nobody's died in so 
> many years.
> 
> What to do about it??? I don't know. Those moments aren't guided by 
> rational thought. Maybe we can step up to the plate as individuals and 
> set an example? Whoever gets dropped because they made the ride a lot 
> safer is the real winner right? Because there's nothing worth dying for 
> on Tuesday night?
> 
> Maybe if the more experienced, foresighted, vocal, responsible riders 
> started to coast slowly through turns, and then sit up to wait for every 
> body to make it around safely after there was no car... and let the 
> break go if someone risked it or happened to be off the front... the 
> tenner of the group might change a little. I don't know, though. I'm as 
> much to blame as any one. Maybe we'll just keep on as we do until 8 
> people die including a pregnant mother putting on makeup in the car on 
> her way to work... Or maybe we'll get bored of Tuesday night racing 
> before then.
> 
> I'm excited to see any results of "accident" research
> 
> Ok
> I have to get out doors before it's dark!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mgarcia at borgwarner.com wrote:
> > At the risk of re-starting the annual inconclusive safety discussion,
> > I would like to ask for opinions on the following topic/question.
> >
> > -> Was the A group response (or non-response) to the car approaching 
> > the Coddington/Whitechurch intersection last night adequate?
> > Did you know that there was a car approaching near the intersection?
> > If you were in the back, did it seem like the group slowed at all?
> > Did the driver have to brake or do something sudden to prevent a
> > collision?
> >
> > We have these long email discussions about safety and "neutralizing the
> > race" but its clear to me that what gets discussed on email and the
> > choices we make in our oxygen-deprived testosterone-driven states are
> > two different things. I am sometimes guilty just like everyone else, but
> > my concept of "neutralizing a race" is that we stop racing and regroup, 
> > not that we let up for a few seconds, check back to see that no one has
> > been killed, and then crank up the pace again before the people who
> > were responsible enough to slow down or stop can get back on. The
> > message
> > is that if you are careful and play it safe, you get dropped.
> >
> > You might say "all's well that ends well" but the people who study 
> > accidents for a living can tell you that for every bad accident there 
> > is almost always an easily-recognizable pattern of many close calls
> > with inadequate remediation before someone is hurt or killed. My
> > opinion is that as a group we just don't get it.  If we don't practice 
> > a true "neutral corner" from time to time we will never ever do it.
> >
> > I'm not much of one to preach but is there any hope for improvement?  
> > Am I over-reacting?  Help me decide.
> >
> > -Ano
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Mariano Garcia 
> > BorgWarner Morse TEC Inc.
> > Ithaca Technical Center
> > 770 Warren Rd.    Ithaca NY 14850
> > Ph: 607-266-2136 (desk) 607-266-2243 (recep)
> > FAX: 607-257-5033
> > email: mgarcia at borgwarner.com
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > FLCC mailing list
> > FLCC at icycle.org
> > http://icycle.org/mailman/listinfo/flcc_icycle.org
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
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> 
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-- 
         *------------------------------------------------------*
         | Bill Goffe                 goffe at oswego.edu          |
         | Department of Economics    voice: (315) 312-3444     |
         | SUNY Oswego                fax:   (315) 312-5444     |
         | 416 Mahar Hall             http://cook.rfe.org       |          
         | Oswego, NY  13126                                    |
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| "Golf, baseball, and PBS programming (except, of course, for nature       |
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|      Magazine, July 24, 2005.                                             |
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